Transcript

Bennie F Johnson 

All right. Hello, and thank you for joining us for this special episode of AMA’s Marketing / And. I’m your host, AMA CEO, Bennie F. Johnson. In our episodes, we explore life through a marketing lens, delving into conversations with individuals that flourish at the intersection of marketing and the unexpected.

We’ll introduce you to visionaries whose stories you might not yet have heard of, but are exactly the ones you need to know. Through our thought-provoking conversations, we’ll unravel the challenges, triumphs, and pivotal moments that have been shaped by marketing. Today, we have two guests joining us, Becky Wixton and Brian Biniak of Balance the Mix. Balance the Mix is a 501c3 nonprofit creating inclusive, fair music solutions that drive both business and social impact. Balance the Mix empowers underrepresented creatives by partnering with brands, agencies, and content creators to deliver fair and inclusive music sourcing, mentorship programs, and access to industry opportunities. From global workshops to ethical licensing, your organization is reshaping how music and music content are made, heard, and valued. Becky and Brian, welcome to the podcast, my friends. So, you know, before we get started, I’d love to get a bit of your background and story. Becky, in your bio, you write half music, half marketing. So how does that happen, and when did that become your realization?

Becky Wixon

Thank you very much for having us.

Bryan Biniak

Thanks for having us.

Becky 

That’s true. So music has traced back to my origins. I started playing in bands from a really young age. I was in an all female rock band in my teenage years and early twenties. And that gave me a real sense of music industry. I was also a and a creator. So I was writing music for a lot of media content like games, TV ads, film TV. And then I went to business school, bit of a pivot.

Bennie 

Okay, right.

Becky 

But I always had an entrepreneurial spirit as well. And I felt that if I went to business school in London, I could do both my music in the London music, but also focus on business and marketing, which was also a real passion of mine, particularly marketing and branding, because I was always interested in the psychology behind it. And when I was at university, I came across a school of thought called Sonic Branding. And that really opened my mind. When I was at university, I came across a school of thought called Sonic branding. And that really opened my mind to a way that the two parts of me could combine, which felt really separate. I think from that point, I felt like which version of me to kind of focus on for career. And Sonic branding felt like the perfect combination for me to do. For those that don’t know, Sonic branding is the translation of a brand essence. Right. To sell music. So if your brand would have… The way that the two parts of me could combine, which felt really separate. Up until that point, I felt like I didn’t know which version of me to kind of focus on for my career. And Sonic Branding felt like the perfect combination of the two. For those that don’t know, Sonic Branding is the translation of a brand essence into sound and music. So if your brand, which has a visual identity, typography, a logo, a tone of voice, what would that sound like through music?

Bennie 

Visual identity, typography, logo, tone of voice, what would that sound like in music? And that’s where I found my niche, I suppose. So after graduating from university, I was working at advertising agencies in London. Eventually landed at Massive Music, which was the world’s biggest song branding agency. And when I was there, I was lucky enough to work on building some.

Becky

And that’s where I really found my niche, I suppose. So after graduating university, I was working at advertising agencies in London, eventually landed at Massive Music, which is the world’s leading sonic branding agency. And when I was there, I was lucky enough to work on building some award winning global sonic identities for brands such as the National Trust, Tresemme, Purcell. And I also started Balance the Mix while I was there.

Bennie

Right because I realized that there was a real gap of women particularly in production roles which was exactly what I had seen in the music industry as well. It was in both of those and in marketing. So Balance the Mix was born.

Becky 

And the reason for that is because I realised that there was a real gap of women, particularly in production roles, which was exactly what I had seen in the music industry as well. So it was in both music and in marketing. So Balance the Mix was born while I was there. It’s definitely had a life of its own since then, which I think we’ll go into. And it’s also where I came into contact with Bryan, who is now my co-founder.

Bennie 

Yeah, I was gonna ask how do we go from this all-female rock band to business school to hanging out with my friend Bryan?

Becky 

Well, Bryan, who I’m sure will tell you in a second, has a route in music as well. And we cross paths whilst working at Song Trader, which is the parent company of Massive Music alongside other brands like Bandcamp. And Bryan was the CMO of and president of Song Trader at the time. And so when I, having made Balance the Mix, born from a sense of, I suppose, frustration,

Bennie

Working at Song Trainer, which is the preparing company of classic music, alongside other brands like Bandcamp.

Bennie

I was working on campaigns for a fully female audience where all of the composers were writing their music.

Becky

In the need for more representation in our industry and also the recognition that we were all losing out by not including these voices. I was working on campaigns for a fully female audience where all of the composers writing the music for that campaign were men. And there was a serious disconnect there because music we know is the emotional universal language.

Bennie 

There was a serious disconnect there because music we know is the emotional universal language. It usually hits first in campaigns. And if we weren’t including the voices of those we were trying to reach in those campaigns, then we weren’t being as effective as we could. So that frustration and recognition of the opportunity as well as to change things.

Becky 

It usually hits you first in a campaign. It’s very visceral. It’s a storytelling tool. And if we weren’t including the voices of those we were trying to reach in those campaigns, then we weren’t being as effective as we could. So that frustration and recognition of the opportunity as well to change things. I knew that only 3% of female, of producers were female. So a lot of progress was needed.

Bennie 

I knew that only 3% of producers were female. So a lot of progress was needed. Balance the Mix started as a very humble music production workshop for women, launched on International Women’s Day in 2023. It was an online Zoom workshop where I very ambitiously wrote some of my own preconceived ideas and

Becky 

Balance the Mix was started as a very humble music production workshop for women, launched on International Women’s Day in 2023. And it was an online Zoom workshop where I very ambitiously wrote a song live, no preconceived ideas, and it was educational. So it was showing budding female producers the process, asking questions. Fast forward a year later, I wanted to bring Balanced Links to a live stage, which is where I came into contact with Bryan, who was the CMO of Song Trader. He had the purse of budget that I needed to put on an event, and that’s where we crossed paths.

Bennie

Bryan, I’m going to get you the opportunity to tell your side of the origin story. Do you remember any of this?

Bryan 

Exactly. Well, it is… Correct, precisely. Becky called and said, I need some money for this project that I’m working on. And, of course I asked how much, but then I, and I said, me more about the program. And it was this kind of serendipitous moment because I had, you know, even though that we were in the same company, there were about 450 people in SongTrip worldwide, acquired 11 different companies over a number of years, and I had not had a chance to collaborate with Becky, but I had been working on something in parallel. We had a number of brands that we work with that were always asking us for very specific types of creative talent, not just types of musicians in terms of the instruments or composers or songwriters or what have you, but people.

So one of the brands that we work with very closely through our big sync business is Unilever. Unilever is one of the most progressive and admirable brands that I’ve had a chance to work with from the standpoint that contractually we need to deliver 35% of the composers.

Bennie

To our big sync business is Unilever. Unilever is one of the most progressive and

Bryan 

Surprisingly, that’s not easy to find people because that’s not how you search for musicians. You don’t search for musicians by gender. You can’t go to these typical sources and say, find me a female who does this. And they’re very progressive at Unilever. I don’t know if you remember a couple of years ago, they also said, every production will have at least one person with a disability, either in front of the camera or behind the camera. Similarly, you’re not going to be able to go search for musicians who are disabled. We had other brands that we work with, like L’Oreal, who said we want to see more of our creative talent coming from our audience, from the LGBT community, and so on and so forth. Meaning, if you look at the kind of ESG SMB wheel, every musician is a small medium-sized business. The majority are minority owned. And then if you look at the DEI wheel, there’s a musician in every single category, including one of the things I learned that the largest employer of musicians in the world is the US military with over 6,500 salaried musicians 138 ensembles and there is no source for searching for, you know, veterans, you know, or active military with music background. So like this just doesn’t make sense. It shouldn’t be this hard. So I had started working on building a talent database to be able to source talent. as, and this is one of the dimensions is as human beings and who their fans are, who their audience are. then the other thing that was missing, there is no source on the planet for all of the music in advertising. You can’t go somewhere and say, here’s all the ads of the world and here’s the music in that ad. It doesn’t exist. Whether it’s an original composition, or a re-record or a commercial license or whatever it is. Everything else is

Bennie

Right. I had started working on building a talent database to be able to source talent and as human beings. who their fans are, who their audience are. And then the other thing that would commit me, there is no source on the planet for all of the music in advertising. You can’t go somewhere and say, here’s and regional competition, or we record or commercialize or whatever it is. Everything else is documented somewhere. So I was learning to work on how do I bring these things together? And we were creating something called song to your town.

Bryan

You know, documented somewhere, but that, I started to work on how do I bring these things together? And we were creating something called Song Trader Talent. And then Becky was working on Balance the Mix, which was about human talent and creating these economic opportunities and being able to bring that humanity together. I’m like, know what? Song Trader Talent is Balance the Mix and, you know, it’s all the same. So we started partnering back in 2023. To see what we could do and create ultimately solutions that scale on a global basis for everybody, whether it’s a global, regional, local kind of campaign for brands and agencies and media companies to access talent that fits the story, that fits the brand, but also fits the audience that they’re trying to connect with, ultimately kind of mirrors that audience. So it’s been…I don’t know, serendipitous fate, something, but it’s been fantastic.

Bennie

Right. Well, I think probably the phrase you want, it’s been good intentioned work, right? You kind of came to it. We’ve talked a bit about some stats that the first time I was hearing what stats in these endeavors have shocked you the most. You know, we get a, we get a sense of, okay, the room, the space, you know, doesn’t have much diversity. The offering looks very much the same. We kind of intrinsically know that and feel that, but what stats have you seen as you’ve been doing this work that have really just blown your mind?

Bryan 

Well, Becky’s been shocked her whole life by these stats. For me and a lot of the people that we talk to, it makes no sense. It’s just illogical, right? To think that 86% of the world’s advertising media now includes music. And that only 3% of the music that’s used is produced by women.

Right. And that just, for me, that doesn’t make sense because over half the planet, over 4 billion women, you know, are audiences for brands and agencies. And the thing that was surprising to me is that, you know, what is something like 55% of Fortune 500 CMOs are now women and over 50% of ad agency executives, including creative leadership.

Bennie

Wow.

Bryan 

Are now women and as part of this, considering that audience, you would think that there would be more of a consciousness about selecting music produced by women to match that audience, casting creative talent in the briefs that match the audience, whether it’s from the composer, producer, the singer, the songwriter, to the instrumentalist, the… All of those…people represent the audiences that they’re marketing to. And it’s just not something that comes up in any creative briefs. Nobody ever calls out, this is the talent that we want. We want it to, and because music is unique from the standpoint that most musicians not only have an audience, but they have fans that come with them. And fans are…you know, pretty much anything that comes out from a musician, they’re on before it even comes out, right? So you get this, you know, group that comes with you. And when we talk to CMOs, and this is something that I’ve been able to do at KIN for the last several years, and you start to talk about this, particularly female CMOs, most of them respond the same way. We’ve never thought about it that way.

We’ve never thought about music in that way, whether it’s about the fans or the audience or that the creative talent can have that background, that natural connection with the audience. it’s surprising. Everybody has the same look. So, you know, I think what’s exciting around this is that there is now enough people with awareness and in positions to make decisions that are

Bryan 

The kind of driver seat in the budgetary driver seat to make that change. And, you know, for 30 years ago, we were at 1% of the music produced by women in advertising. And we’ve only got the 3%. And, but now we’re in a position for people to make what we think are our database decisions. To make the investments to bring those connections. And we should see measurable results from aligning creative talent with that marketing. And we think we can do more in three years than has been done in 30.

Bennie

So when I hear both of you talk about the space, I immediately think about the sticky middle part of the process. Becky, this is your transition from being in the band to going to business school, kind of the space. We know with empirical data that the talent is there, that the creators are there, and we know that the business opportunity is there. It seems to me that there’s the opportunity and where we need the additional attention, which we’re working on, is how do you get the talent into the business pipeline and spaces. Because I’m sure if you’re brought to a love of music, you’re not immediately thinking about how do I get my craft embedded into agencies, embedded into the work. And I’m wondering about that space, what things can we do to firm up that sticky middle part from being pure creator to creator engaged with industry.

Becky 

It’s a difficult time at the moment for musicians in the world. There’s technology which has been incredibly innovative and it’s improved accessibility and access for so many people. But at the same time, it’s become more difficult than ever for musicians to get paid. So if you think about the way that most people listen to music these days is probably a streaming service like Spotify.

Bennie 

Technology which has been incredibly innovative and it’s improved.

Becky 

And unfortunately, the model of streaming services tend not to value particularly independent musicians. So currently, over 9 % of the income from streaming goes to just 1% of the artists. And across the industry, only 5% of musicians state that they have a sustainable income. So the more traditional revenue streams that artists used to depend on, selling records, going on tour, live music, is becoming more difficult, more challenging. And what we identified was whilst the traditional parts of the industry were struggling, this opportunity was opening up in what we call a sound on era. If you think about the way that media existed 20, 30 years ago, it was largely 2D, right? It would be a magazine, it would be a bus stop, it would be a billboard.

And these days, as Bryan said, most ads, most media is making noise. It’s social, it’s TV, it’s radio. 86% of ads now include sound. So it’s become more relevant than ever for brands to be including music. It’s important for them to consider their sonic identity. It’s important for them to consider how that music taps into culture and thus how that culture taps into their audience.

So we recognized at Balance the Mix that there was a real opportunity in this niche of music and media. And I’d experienced this as well myself. I had a tough time as an artist in the industry. It was difficult to get paid. It was long hours. You know, having to wear lots of hats. And then I experienced the abundance that comes from getting a sink placement, from working with an advertiser.

And getting paid for your music being on a TV ad or being on a social campaign. And I’ve worked as a producer at Massive Music and with other agencies and discovered the freedom that that gives to artists when they can actually start to pay their bills. They can start to live their life, their craft can start to support them. And I think that’s a real superpower that marketers have that they don’t necessarily recognise that they could be a launchpad for these artists. They could be a lot of the time, a lifeline to these artists who are, quite frankly, failed by the traditional music industry, where brands who have budgets, they have more content than ever that’s making sound. If they then consider who’s behind that music, and this is the key, that we don’t see enough diverse voices, particularly in roles like production.

Who are then representing their audience. And that’s the connection that we’re trying to make. This is the inspiration that we’re trying to bring to marketers to recognize this is an untapped opportunity. You could be a real support system for artists and saving culture, not to mention AI, which is another big challenge that’s coming for musicians. And not only that, it also benefits your creative because it’s more authentic. It’s resonating with your audiences. So those are the dots that we’re really trying to connect.

Bennie 

I love that you touched on something that really speaks to artists of all different backgrounds and genre. That moment in which you get the economic recognition that what you’re doing is real. So so many artists in space in there, it’s not their creativity that fails them. It’s often their friends, their family, and everyone else that says what you’re doing isn’t real. It’s not a real job. It’s not a real this.

And having that moment when, like you said, that first check comes in and you can book your own studio time. You can build your own studio. can, so, you know, because you’re mentioning, we’re not talking about frivolous bills. We’re talking about the bills that go along with this production and work. And then it opens up all these new avenues of creativity. Because now you’re a legitimate Bryan, right?

Bryan

Yeah, is, know, and producers are so incredibly important in the creative process. I mean, if you look at what Quincy Jones did for Michael Jackson or Phil Ramone did for Billy Joel, they literally transformed the music and the albums, the successes, you know, that changed culture and lifestyle, you know, for people all over the world. And that that was shaped through that storytelling that they did end to end, you know, whether it was the composition, you know, the songwriting, the mixing, the editing, you know, that’s just the sounds, all of these things. And now these are sounds that everybody else draws upon. You know, so if you think about the age of A.I. that we’re in. The history of music is now embodied in what is shaping the new history of music and fusions of all of these different music types.

Bennie 

The example of like these production artist combos that we think of that are so tied and linked. And I remember watching the documentary and reading the stories about that, that the record label didn’t want Michael Jackson to work with Quincy Jones. He was an unconventional choice. He was the jazz guy. As far as the record label was concerned, they wanted a classic Philly sound producer.

And think about the world, that’s a creative choice, right? Think about the world of music we would have had if that wasn’t the pairing.

Bryan 

Yeah, there was there. I don’t know if you’ve seen the new Billy Joel documentary, which was really interesting. The record label wanted him to work with George Martin and they met and George was like, great, let’s do this, but you got to replace your band. I’ll give you, know, who should be in your band. Well, we’ll get you the right musicians. And Billy Joel said no. And he’s like, this is the team.

Right? These are the people. This is how we work together. And eventually they found Phil Ramone and he got it, right? He got how important this kind of ensemble of talent came together to create these unique experiences, these unique sounds. And because it wasn’t just about the, what they recorded is about what they did on stage and how they connected with audiences that really drove the success of Billy Joel. And you’ve seen it with him selling out Madison Garden now for a decade of how people come there. And they’re part of that experience. It’s something that surprises me all of the time, because when people are choosing the music and the artists that they want in their advertising, when it comes to the value of the fans and the audience that they bring, there’s no ascribed value, right? You don’t say, this person has a million fans. Those million fans are worth whatever, right? Even just to acknowledge that. And then in many instances, you know, in most instances, what then the brands and agencies do is then hire somebody else to go create marketing to connect with the people that already come with the artists instead of just saying, hey, we should just have a deeper connection with you because you have these authentic connections and they’re gonna, you your fans are your ride or dies. They go with you everywhere and you don’t have to ask, you get them. And so it’s, you know, hopefully that changes over time. I think there are some brands that get that.

Bennie

Yeah, the brands that get the, you know, beyond the music and the musician and the character. I have a friend who did a campaign a couple of years ago with Weber Grill and he showed them a bit of social data that they never would have expected that hip hop zone DJ Jazzy Jeff had a complete overlay with their target audience and was unexpected.

And they ended up doing a summertime DJ beach party with Jazzy Jeff for their Weber Grill Brands. And huge hit, Generation, Focus, AIM, his appeal was brought kind of spot on, but having the DJ Music Pack be a background support for that. But it spoke to his following, their audience, and that mesh that you mentioned.

Bryan 

We, several years ago, I put together a session for WPP at Cannes Lion for the anniversary of hip hop. So we got Kevin Lyles from 300 Electra Entertainment, who had been at Def Jam, and Londell McMillan from The Source, and Lady London, who was a Def Jam artist, and Dave Rolfe, who heads up global production for WPP and Hogarth and we talked about the origin of hip hop, right? And house parties, and it was about community, it was about connection and culture and the music kind of came out of that. And that hip hop is music, but it is culture, it’s lifestyle, is apparel and fashion and sport and so many other things that are kind of integrated and where’s the line between those things? And there isn’t, right? And I think everybody tries to put it in a box.

Bennie 

Right. Well, really there isn’t in this space in there and that’s that authentic power that marketing and brands can have when we tap into the culture. I’m going to touch on something that we talked a bit about. Becky started to tempt us with a little bit of discussion of AI and we’ve started to talk a little bit about hip hop and the DJ. And we know that technology and creators and musicians have always gone hand in hand to push the arts forward. We think about music.

What are you excited about when you see what creators may be able to do introducing AI into the mix?

Becky 

So I am a producer and I didn’t really understand AI and music for a long time. I thought it was a bit of a gimmick. You can put a prompt in and it will pop out a little song and I didn’t really take it too seriously. And I think what’s been happening in certainly recent months and it’s happening at speed is these tools are becoming genuinely helpful for producers and artists. So in recent weeks even, I’ve been working on some production briefs where utilising tools, AI tools and music have helped me to speed up my process. So you can split stems, you can generate ideas, you can get some instrumentals played that otherwise you might need to, you know, source from elsewhere. It’s definitely helping with efficiency. It’s also really helping with access.

So previously, even 10, 20 years ago, making music was really expensive. You’d have to pay for studio time, you’d have to pay for a producer. The gear was really expensive. And over the last decade or so, all of that technology has just opened the gates to those who may not have been able to afford it before. So I’m really here for that. I think these tools are really helping to…give access and stop gatekeepers from making this industry something that’s only available for those who’ve got contacts or money. And I think that will solve a lot of problems in terms of what we’re really advocating for at Balance the Mix, in terms of helping more underrepresented artists to get opportunities. And I definitely think that access has been a huge barrier to the reason that those people haven’t had opportunities so far in education, but also in the tools. So I’m really, really here for that.

Bennie 

And I definitely think that access is a huge barrier to the reason that most people haven’t had opportunities so far in education, but also in the talks. So I’m really, good at that. I think the risks are the fact that we’re

Becky 

I think the risks are the fact that AI is, everyone can see, is using copyrighted material to then generate from. And the reality is that we know based on the stats that 97% of all of that music has been created by men, mostly white men. So we’ve got to be really careful about the stereotypes that we’re continuing because that’s what it’s been built upon.

If we want an industry to be reflective, if we want it to be inclusive, if we want it to be authentic, then we can’t just be going around the same cycles that we already have. So I have my concerns about the future of AI, but I’m trying to stay positive because my personal opinion of it is it’s here and it’s not going away. And in the same way that sampling revolutionized, we talk about hip hop when sampling happened in the 80s, it was the same. People were completely against it. There are lawsuits.

Bennie

Right. I was gonna say that, but the lawsuits, I’m thinking for our hip hop heads in here, I’m thinking De La Soul, Three Feet High and Rising, like all of the number of samples that are there that you couldn’t make that album today with all the clearance, they would have to go in there, but there’s something magical about that, right, in the space in there. We talk a lot about music and creative work going forward.

I’m going to take a little bit of a time machine pivot. And where do you see opportunity for brands to also mine the catalog, if you will? I’ve seen so many commercials in the last few years that have a run through nostalgia that are pulling older pieces of music that are elevating it to kind of from front and center as well. Do you see any benefits in that in some of the artists who’ve put the time and energy in who, as I said, are diverse? Creators who are now getting those tracks played in conjunction with contemporary brands.

Becky 

Yeah, I think any kind of license from a brand is an opportunity for an artist. It’s going to be a big payout. And if brands are considering where that’s going to a little bit more closely, even if that’s a bad catalogue, I think that’s a beautiful thing. There’s an example from Diageo, and this was a Grand Prix award winning piece at Cannes Lions, and it was called Arata 88 from Johnny Walker. And it was honoring

Bennie 

It was honoring a black Brazilian singer, Adelaide Costa, who was a pioneer in bossing.

Becky 

A black Brazilian singer, Adelaide Costa, who was a pioneer in bossa nova. But she was forgotten. And they ended up giving her recognition, showcasing her with a major brand partnership, using her music when she was 88 years old. And I think it was a really great example of inclusive sound.

And the use of music, like you say, and tapping into a back catalogue. And it’s not overdue, you know, even though she’d got on a bit, she’s 88 years old now, it still gave her the platform and the recognition that she didn’t get back in the day when the music industry was way less aware of giving credit where it was due. So I think brands like DRGO, great example of the platform that is available with any kind of sync, whether that’s a back catalog piece from years ago, or it’s a current track.

Bennie 

Bryan, I’m going to ask you this question because you spend a lot of time talking to senior executives and CMOs, right? And we’ve talked about the creative group, the creative mix, but I know one thing that’s always in those conversations with CMOs and their C-suite counterparts are effectiveness. You know, what can you speak to about, you know, the effectiveness of having these partnerships with more diverse contemporary creators to pushing your brand? And the impact for the business.

Bryan 

Well, I think the operative word is creator that you used, right? So sometimes there’s a limited definition of what music is, right? Music is more than just what you hear. And musicians are more than what they play. And because they are creators and they’re storytellers and they’re marketers, and their community managers and their business people, right? And you, when you’re a musician, you’re touring, you’ve got merchandise, you’re building communities, you’re building relationships, you’re building all of these different things. And you’re able to connect with people at many different levels and tell your story in many different ways, whether it’s…you what you write, you know, in the lyrics, in the composition itself, in what you play and how you perform. And so when you bring all of this kind of creativity to the, the. In advertising, the creative process and you, you open up your mind that the musicians can actually contribute more than just a sound file.

You gain so much, right? Because there’s a lot, you know, there’s these other people in the room that have a voice that if you listen to, you’re going to get significantly more value. And then ultimately what gets created more and more, it’s people are not, they understand that a linear experience is a thing is part of it, but it’s not the only thing. People are looking for those social hooks in their advertising. Even before an ad goes out, right, before it airs, you have these connections with communities of people. if you architect it in the right way, in an authentic way, it carries with you… Beyond what you see and beyond what you hear into conversations, into culture, into lifestyle. And I think that that is something that musicians can authentically contribute to the creative process. But if you’re just say, hey, deliver this sound file to me. I need it by tomorrow at noon. Sounds like this needs to be this amount. Do it in this amount of budget. And great, and move on then you miss a tremendous opportunity.

Bennie

I think you’re absolutely right. We see that with lots of creative spaces. You miss the opportunity for the art, science, and magic that is in that creator to be a part of your brand instead of being just added on at the end. How do we build the better strategy in the space? So when you look at the work that you’ve done in just a short period of time with Balance to Mix, what are you most proud of these days?

Becky 

So we’ve, as well as the brand partnerships, the speaking events that we’ve spoken about, we also do a lot of community work. So we have, we’ve done some music production workshops, most recently in Dubai. It was the first music production workshop for women in that region. We’ve done a mentorship program, which is currently coming to a close in the UK, where we matched 10 emerging female producers with 10 industry experts.

And already we’re getting feedback that those who are on our mentorship scheme are landing real work with big briefs and it’s changing their lives. And I think that’s the real important takeaway of what we’re doing at Balance the Mix is we’re trying to move the dial here. We want to close the gap because what we believe is that when music is more inclusive, it sounds better, it resonates harder, it’s reflecting our human experience.

And if we’re only hearing from a small select few people, then we’re all missing out. And I think in the context of brands and marketers, when we’re telling stories, when we’re tapping into people’s emotions, when we’re trying to express ourselves, don’t we want to make sure we’re doing that in the richest way possible? So I think that’s what we’re most proud of is doing that work on the ground and changing this in the future.

Bryan

I would add that something as simple as what Becky and I did, which is to quit perfectly good jobs, to go work for pretty much nothing in a nonprofit. In fact, we’re doing the opposite. We’re investing our own money to build this. At a moment in time where brands and agencies and just many people around the world, particularly in the United States are…shine away, let’s just put it in a nice way from diversity, equity and inclusion. And we decided to double down. And we think that now is not just the right moment, it’s the best moment because that’s, think, when you’re at a moment of divisiveness and…

And all of these challenges are usually when the best innovation happens and when people come together. We were talking yesterday to a woman, Grace in London, who said PhD student, and she put together this database of all of these organizations in Europe that are working to support female musicians.

And, and, and the challenges and, and I asked when she’s going to do something in the U S and she said, she’s waiting. And I’m like, what are you waiting for? She’s like, well, I thought maybe now was not the right time and that it, you know, people would not support it. I’m like, absolutely. It is the right time. It is the most important time to do this work. and the thing that makes it, I think easier for us is that when you bring that business sense to this, when you bring the data when you bring the economics, when you can show the results and the connections and how one plus one is three, then it truly is something that everybody can do, should do, and should have always been doing. And I think this is just one of those surprisingly overlooked things because it is merit-based. You should have talent that reflects your audience. You should have talent that you know, can tell authentic stories. It’s not that, you know, and, by the way, in we have the data on return on inclusion that shows, you know, that, that it is going to deliver you with greater value. It’s going to build your brand. It’s going to build your audience. It’s going to drive engagement. And ultimately it’s going to help you sell more. You’re going to make more money when you do this, you know, and then I think, you know, hopefully in the not too distant future, people will look back on how much money that they lost by not being more inclusive and equalizing their music and doing things like Balance the Mix.

Bennie 

Take this moment and not to be perverse. I’m going to quote the late Andy Warhol that business is art and good business is the best art. And this really kind of speaks to that moment in there and how these things run together. I’m still blown away. I got a chance to see a performance a few years ago of Yo-Yo Ma, Silk Road. And it was incredible. There were three musicians that did a world tour of music history. One was on some sort of string instrument that has long been forgotten. The other musician was on a violin. And the third musician was a beatboxer from Philly.

And in any way, this represented diversity of the human experience, the cultural experience at its finest. But it proved to what you did. It was balanced. It was the mix. It was life for everyone in the room from all different backgrounds and ages were brought together by this musical journey. You know, I think the work that you do is so important and it speaks to the fact that good marketing is in the mix for everybody.

So there’s so many great nuggets that you guys have shared with us. I do before we leave, I can’t believe we’re the close of our episode. If there’s one bit of advice you would each give to our marketers who are building their brands and want to include music in a more authentic way, what’s the one bit of advice you would give to them?

Becky

I think I would say who makes the work shapes the work. And that is regarding all elements of your marketing. Who is directing, who is producing, who is writing and who is making your music. Because ultimately as a marketer, you are trying to connect with people. You are trying to reach an audience. And so if you are including those voices that you are trying to reach in the creation of your content, then it is going resonate. So that’s my advice, who makes the work shapes the work.

Bryan

And you can, that comes to life in a creative brief, right? Your creative brief is a blueprint for really the equalizing across the boards, not just your music, but all of your creative talent. know, if you take that extra time to specify who you want to do the work, because you know, if you cast the way you cast in front of the camera, the way you cast on the other side,

Bennie 

And that comes to life in a creative way.

Bryan

You’re gonna be much more successful.

Bennie

There it is. I want to thank you, my friends, for joining us. Half music, half marketing, all impact. Thank you for the work you’re doing at Balance the Mix and taking us through this journey of the impact of music, authenticity, and brands on our lives as marketers.

Thank you again, and thank you all for listening and joining us for this episode of AMA’s Marketing / And. If you want to learn more about music and creators being incorporated into your work, we invite you to reach out and follow up on Balance the Mix. As always, join us on AMA.org for more programming and content and to hear the best in sonic branding. Thank you.